Unlock the secrets to remote work productivity with insights from Luke Shermer, Managing Director and Founder of Launch Tomorrow. Discover how nearly a decade of managing remote teams has equipped Luke with unique strategies to overcome the challenges of dispersed work environments. From navigating team dynamics to setting clear objectives and maintaining accountability, Luke’s practical tips will empower any remote team to thrive.
Explore the crucial role of building trust within remote teams as Luke recounts his journey from an accidental remote worker to leading a permanently remote setup. Learn how to shift from traditional hierarchical mindsets to a culture of facilitation and adaptability, and how to address initial client perceptions about the absence of a physical office. Luke emphasizes the importance of establishing clear goals and accountability to foster a dependable and high-performing remote team.
Tired of endless meetings that drain your energy? Luke shares his strategies for optimizing meetings to boost productivity and avoid burnout. Discover how to distinguish essential meetings from those better suited for asynchronous communication, and apply creative solutions to keep your team engaged and efficient. Learn about practical time-blocking techniques, the importance of shared calendars, and how to balance managerial duties with creative tasks. Join us for a wealth of knowledge on maintaining work-life harmony in remote settings and get a sneak peek into the innovative projects at Launch Tomorrow.
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Remote Work Productivity Insights With Luke
Speaker 1
0:00
Hello
everybody
.
It's
Alex
,
alex
Wilson-Campbell
from
the
Remote
Work
Life
podcast
Joining
me
today
.
I
have
a
wonderful
guest
.
I
have
Luke
Shermer
.
Luke
is
the
Managing
Director
and
Founder
of
Launch
Tomorrow
and
he
has
such
a
depth
of
knowledge
when
it
comes
to
remote
work
but
not
just
remote
work
and
I'm
going
to
let
him
sort
of
give
you
a
bit
more
detail
in
a
moment
.
But
I
you
know
,
we've
been
speaking
for
a
little
while
and
I
just
really
wanted
to
have
Luke
on
the
podcast
today
to
share
with
you
all
he's
learned
,
I
guess
,
or
much
of
what
he's
learned
about
remote
work
and
Luke
,
he's
managed
and
participated
in
remote
work
and
remote
only
knowledge
work
teams
for
almost
a
decade
.
Most
recently
,
he
led
a
program
approximately
30
distributed
across
.
I'm
making
real
mess
of
this
today
.
I'm
really
sorry
,
oh
dear
me
.
Speaker 2
1:01
That's
all
right
.
Speaker 1
1:02
That's
all
right
.
Do
you
mind
if
I
start
again
?
Let's
start
from
the
top
.
Speaker 2
1:07
No
problem
,
okay
,
sorry
about
this
.
It's
mostly
you
talking
,
so
I
don't
mind
.
Speaker 1
1:12
Right
,
he's
managed
.
I've
practiced
this
so
many
times
and
I
can't
get
it
right
.
He's
managed
remote-only
knowledge
work
teams
for
almost
a
decade
.
Most
recently
,
he
led
a
program
of
approximately
30
distributed
.
That
should
be
I
think
it
was
a
typo
there
30
distributed
.
Is
that
people
?
People
?
Speaker 2
1:36
yeah
,
yeah
,
okay
,
I
might
have
typed
it
,
not
quite
yeah
.
Speaker 1
1:44
Yeah
.
Speaker 2
1:44
I
don't
think
I've
actually
read
it
out
loud
myself
,
come
to
think
of
it
.
So
it
may
it
may
be
it
may
be
actually
a
hard
one
to
read
.
Speaker 1
1:51
Do
you
want
me
to
go
?
Do
you
want
me
to
do
something
?
Speaker 2
1:56
else
then
,
in
terms
of
the
intro
,
or
are
you
happy
with
?
Yeah
,
absolutely
,
I
mean
,
you
know
whatever
whatever
,
um
,
however
,
you
want
to
do
it
,
I
think
,
and
yeah
,
especially
if
it's
coming
,
you
know
,
coming
from
you
,
I
think
that's
even
better
.
Speaker 1
2:08
Right
.
Yeah
,
there's
a
couple
of
things
.
Align
remotely
,
right
?
Hi
guys
,
it's
Alex
once
again
from
Remote
Work
Life
.
Thank
you
for
joining
me
once
again
Today
.
I
have
another
special
guest
to
have
with
me
today
Luke
Shermer
.
Speaker 1
2:28
Now
,
luke
has
been
in
the
world
of
remote
work
for
a
number
of
years
and
,
as
you
know
,
we
only
really
accept
and
speak
to
people
who
have
an
in-depth
knowledge
in
remote
work
,
because
I
think
that's
the
way
we
can
learn
best
and
how
we
can
,
you
know
,
through
sharing
what
we've
learned
,
sharing
what
we've
practiced
on
a
day-to-day
basis
,
from
learning
from
those
who
know
the
world
of
remote
work
best
.
Speaker 1
2:55
And
Luke
has
managed
or
participated
in
remote-only
knowledge
work
teams
for
almost
a
decade
and
most
recently
,
he
led
a
program
of
approximately
30
distributed
people
across
13
time
zones
and
eight
different
locations
.
Over
the
last
nine
years
,
he's
led
teams
building
software
,
running
,
marketing
and
sales
,
and
launched
a
best-selling
book
as
well
at
the
same
time
,
called
align
remotely
.
So
look
out
for
that
.
In
many
cases
,
with
people
you've
been
working
with
,
you've
never
met
them
or
spoke
to
them
in
person
,
and
I
mean
that's
something
really
special
in
terms
of
the
whole
lot
,
in
terms
of
what
Luke
has
done
,
which
,
as
I
said
why
I
wanted
to
get
him
on
the
program
today
.
So
,
luke
,
thank
you
for
joining
us
today
,
and
you're
very
,
very
welcome
.
Speaker 2
3:46
Yeah
,
alex
,
it's
really
,
it's
really
a
great
pleasure
.
I'm
a
huge
fan
of
the
podcast
,
so
I'm
glad
to
glad
to
be
glad
to
chat
.
Speaker 1
3:54
And
Luke
he's
.
Not
only
is
he
a
fellow
podcaster
as
well
.
Actually
,
I
think
what
you
should
do
as
well
is
look
out
for
Luke
at
launch
tomorrow
,
and
we're
going
to
talk
a
little
bit
about
that
as
the
show
goes
on
.
But
launch
tomorrow
is
is
Luke's
main
venture
at
the
moment
,
and
today
,
on
today's
show
,
we're
going
to
talk
about
why
companies
struggle
with
remote
productivity
.
That's
a
big
topic
.
I
I
mean
,
especially
in
an
office
.
Productivity
tends
to
be
monitored
at
an
individual
level
,
but
actually
the
impact
on
a
business
depends
on
how
well
teams
work
together
.
And
I
think
,
luke
,
I
think
you
can
really
share
some
of
your
pearls
of
wisdom
with
us
today
to
kind
of
reveal
not
only
how
you
do
it
,
but
also
how
many
of
the
people
that
,
or
many
of
the
businesses
,
that
you
work
with
are
doing
it
as
well
.
Speaker 1
4:49
So
it's
brilliant
,
absolutely
.
But
my
first
question
did
you
envision
,
envision
,
envision
,
envision
?
Can't
get
my
words
out
?
Envision
yourself
in
your
current
role
,
and
I
mean
,
tell
us
how
you
reached
where
you
are
today
.
Speaker 2
5:14
Sure
,
absolutely
so
.
I
was
at
one
company
for
many
years
that
became
increasingly
remote
and
kind
of
worked
through
various
roles
there
over
time
.
Initially
I
was
more
of
a
line
contributor
,
eventually
became
more
of
a
manager
and
got
remote
teams
to
run
,
initially
small
teams
and
larger
teams
and
,
I
think
,
pre-pandemic
.
Most
of
the
people
that
I
talked
to
if
we
were
talking
about
work
over
beers
or
something
they
were
just
amazed
or
surprised
that
it's
possible
to
run
remote
teams
and
build
complex
things
like
software
with
everybody
completely
remote
teams
and
build
complex
things
like
software
,
like
with
everybody
completely
remote
.
Speaker 2
5:48
Uh
well
,
at
least
outside
of
the
software
industry
,
to
be
fair
,
um
and
uh
,
yeah
,
and
then
basically
,
like
as
soon
as
the
,
as
soon
as
the
pandemic
hit
,
it
was
like
I
felt
like
I
had
a
lot
of
experience
built
up
over
the
years
,
uh
,
or
scar
tissue
,
however
you
want
to
call
it
and
you
know
,
uh
,
these
were
things
that
I
thought
would
be
helpful
for
people
because
at
the
time
there
was
lots
of
you
know
listicles
of
37
tools
to
help
you
go
remote
,
kind
of
.
Speaker 2
6:13
You
know
,
if
you
think
back
to
like
March
or
April
of
last
year
,
there
was
a
whole
bunch
of
things
like
that
and
I
think
in
practice
I
felt
other
things
were
actually
more
important
,
that
eventually
people
would
kind
of
realize
that
or
come
across
certain
things
which
I'd
already
experienced
in
the
past
which
I
could
help
share
with
.
And
I
think
the
key
thing
actually
,
I
think
for
me
was
the
mindset
that
productivity
as
a
team
matters
a
lot
more
than
as
an
individual
.
And
I
think
in
an
office
it's
easy
to
kind
of
fall
back
to
.
You
know
,
are
people
showing
up
,
are
they
sitting
at
their
computer
,
are
they
doing
things
,
and
you
know
,
for
some
type
of
work
maybe
that's
good
enough
.
But
I
think
,
especially
when
you're
in
a
remote
setting
,
you've
got
to
get
kind
of
deeper
into
how
the
actual
team
works
together
to
really
get
to
the
bottom
of
of
,
um
,
of
,
of
,
of
how
to
get
Building Trust in Remote Work
Speaker 2
7:07
things
done
.
Speaker 1
7:07
Basically
,
so
for
you
then
,
when
you
started
working
remotely
,
was
that
by
,
by
,
by
design
,
or
was
it
just
just
you
know
,
just
your
,
your
preference
?
Speaker 2
7:25
Was
that
your
preference
or
by
design
?
Speaker 2
7:31
It
was
kind
of
by
accident
.
Speaker 2
7:38
So
what
happened
was
that
I
realized
that
I
was
working
with
a
team
of
remote
people
sitting
in
London
and
in
fact
I
think
at
one
point
,
even
though
I
had
,
I
think
at
the
time
,
around
13
people
,
I
was
the
only
one
in
London
.
Speaker 2
7:44
Even
though
I
had
,
I
think
at
the
time
,
around
13
people
,
I
was
the
only
one
in
London
and
for
personal
reasons
,
we
thought
it
would
be
good
to
go
back
,
move
back
to
Warsaw
to
be
closer
to
family
.
You
know
,
have
a
daughter
,
wanted
her
to
have
closer
contact
to
family
and
you
know
,
in
fact
it
was
completely
optional
that
I
was
physically
in
London
.
I
mean
,
some
of
my
stakeholders
were
there
,
but
I
,
you
know
,
I
agreed
with
them
that
I
was
physically
in
London
.
I
mean
,
some
of
my
stakeholders
were
there
,
but
I
agreed
with
them
that
I'd
fly
in
when
needed
and
set
up
a
couple
of
flights
after
I
moved
.
But
it
just
kind
of
evolved
from
there
and
then
it
just
became
the
way
things
worked
while
I
was
with
this
company
full-time
and
then
over
time
it
evolved
out
into
just
doing
various
bits
of
kind
of
remote
work
,
remote
consulting
,
and
it
kind
of
went
from
there
.
Speaker 1
8:36
And
,
as
with
many
people
,
when
they're
starting
out
remote
not
just
individuals
but
teams
there
can
be
various
challenges
,
I
guess
,
various
different
things
that
remote
work
can
sort
of
um
throw
up
,
I
guess
sometimes
unexpectedly
.
What's
been
your
biggest
challenge
and
how
have
you
been
able
to
to
overcome
that
,
to
really
build
the
business
that
you've
built
today
?
Speaker 2
9:11
I
think
the
biggest
challenge
,
especially
initially
,
was
around
shifting
the
culture
that
I
was
in
,
the
company
culture
that
I
was
in
,
which
is
relatively
,
let's
say
,
traditional
and
hierarchical
,
into
accepting
more
things
like
facilitation
.
Speaker 2
9:33
And
part
of
that
was
just
things
that
I
was
doing
outside
with
other
companies
and
bringing
it
in
kind
of
on
the
side
,
and
part
of
that
was
just
me
literally
stepping
out
of
my
own
for
lack
of
a
better
term
comfort
zone
,
kind
of
being
within
the
way
things
are
and
being
willing
to
change
things
and
push
things
a
bit
.
Speaker 2
9:56
And
I
think
,
in
a
way
,
this
is
one
of
the
ways
the
pandemic
has
actually
been
a
good
thing
,
because
I
think
a
lot
of
,
a
lot
of
the
assumptions
that
were
very
entrenched
that
I
had
to
work
against
,
I
think
,
were
put
into
question
,
so
it
was
easier
to
do
that
.
Speaker 2
10:12
I
think
also
,
by
the
time
this
was
this
was
happening
last
year
the
tools
to
be
able
to
do
that
to
facilitate
groups
,
group
meetings
,
workshops
online
were
much
more
mature
than
they
were
,
say
,
five
years
ago
,
for
example
,
where
you
have
big
online
whiteboards
and
you
can
fully
kind
of
prototype
plan
out
entire
complicated
systems
,
admittedly
on
a
call
together
,
but
you
can
really
get
into
quite
deep
things
and
there's
,
you
know
,
there's
certain
things
you
lose
doing
this
online
versus
in
person
,
but
there's
also
a
lot
of
things
you
gain
,
and
to
some
extent
it's
tools
,
but
it's
also
just
this
whole
idea
that
,
as
a
manager
,
my
primary
role
,
my
mindset
,
was
that
I
need
to
be
a
facilitator
and
not
kind
of
an
executor
,
and
I
think
,
particularly
in
a
remote
context
,
that
really
helps
a
lot
,
where
you
know
you
assume
people
want
to
be
there
,
they
want
to
be
doing
their
job
,
and
it's
all
about
helping
them
come
together
to
achieve
what
it
is
that
the
company
wants
them
to
achieve
.
Speaker 2
11:27
And
,
of
course
,
if
there
are
blockers
,
then
go
figure
out
what
they
are
together
and
then
try
to
unblock
it
for
them
or
help
them
do
it
themselves
.
Speaker 2
11:37
That
kind
of
thing
,
so
it
is
a
slightly
different
mindset
and
,
to
some
extent
,
skill
set
too
.
Speaker 1
11:46
So
it
is
a
slightly
different
mindset
and
,
to
some
extent
,
skill
set
too
,
yeah
,
and
I
think
,
well
,
the
fact
that
you
evolved
into
that
manager
is
,
yeah
,
it
is
a
mindset
,
but
also
you
have
to
be
willing
to
change
as
well
,
don't
you
,
in
terms
of
the
way
you
were
and
the
way
you
are
.
So
there's
that
challenge
as
well
.
I
think
one
of
my
biggest
challenges
when
I
first
started
working
remotely
was
um
perception
that
my
clients
had
of
me
not
not
having
an
office
,
that
they
,
you
know
they
.
So
when
I
told
them
you
know
,
I
work
remotely
,
I
work
from
a
,
from
here
,
that
literally
here
,
there
and
so
the
first
question
to
me
would
be
so
where's
your
office
?
How
can
we
sort
of
get
in
touch
with
you
?
And
I
said
,
well
,
you
can
use
my
phone
or
you
can
Skype
me
or
you
can
Zoom
that
sort
of
thing
.
That
was
one
of
my
biggest
challenges
.
Speaker 1
12:40
Obviously
,
that's
now
no
longer
a
challenge
,
because
I've
literally
always
been
working
yeah
,
um
,
exactly
,
but
no
,
that's
that's
interesting
,
yours
,
yours
was
more
around
sort
of
the
,
the
mindset
and
the
facilitation
as
opposed
to
managerial
side
.
I
think
a
lot
of
people
,
actually
now
a
lot
of
managers
,
are
coming
to
terms
with
that
.
Um
,
trying
a
bit
,
I
suppose
it
takes
being
a
bit
more
.
I
suppose
at
the
heart
of
it
it
takes
trust
,
doesn't
it
?
Trusting
who
you
work
with
,
trusting
your
team
,
would
you
say
.
Speaker 2
13:13
Yes
,
it
does
.
It
takes
trust
,
it
takes
,
it
does
take
skills
,
although
you
can
learn
them
as
you
go
,
I
think
also
.
So
I
think
,
yeah
,
I
mean
,
I
think
with
the
trust
,
I
mean
,
speaking
of
trust
,
I
mean
I
think
with
the
trust
component
.
I
think
one
of
the
big
challenges
with
trust
is
in
an
environment
where
you
don't
have
very
clear
objectives
or
there's
like
multiple
people
that
are
trying
to
define
what
the
company
is
supposed
to
do
.
It's
not
very
clear
.
Therefore
,
it's
not
clear
who's
accountable
,
it's
not
clear
how
things
are
going
to
happen
.
Speaker 2
14:01
And
then
in
that
,
in
that
context
,
it's
very
difficult
to
have
a
trusting
relationship
in
every
direction
,
above
you
and
below
you
,
so
to
speak
.
Um
,
because
then
it's
like
you
know
what
,
what
?
What
is
it
that
people
are
actually
doing
?
Are
they
actually
doing
it
?
Are
they
doing
something
that
matters
?
Like
you've
got
to
work
out
how
,
how
to
how
,
how
to
get
that
trust
,
and
I
think
you
know
the
the
easiest
way
that
that
I've
managed
to
do
that
is
to
always
,
every
time
I
get
into
this
kind
of
a
situation
,
is
to
,
as
quickly
as
possible
,
first
of
all
,
clarify
the
objectives
so
everyone
is
clear
on
what
it
is
that's
going
on
,
and
usually
it's
just
like
getting
things
to
be
internally
consistent
and
like
really
kind
of
string
people
at
the
initial
meetings
to
figure
out
you
know
how
it
all
comes
together
.
Speaker 2
14:53
And
then
,
in
terms
of
the
actual
trust
bit
,
it's
trying
to
divide
up
the
work
into
small
enough
pieces
that
you
can
see
that
people
are
working
through
them
,
they're
collaborating
to
kind
of
work
through
each
of
the
pieces
and
to
allow
them
.
To
allow
them
to
come
together
and
create
the
space
for
them
to
come
together
when
needed
,
but
not
force
them
to
be
in
Zoom
,
doom
and
monitoring
,
because
that
,
if
anything
erodes
trust
,
right
,
it's
a
sign
of
lack
of
trust
,
so
to
speak
.
And
I
mean
I
think
meetings
in
general
are
kind
of
they're
not
,
they're
not
corporate
culture
.
They're
,
they're
not
the
only
part
of
corporate
culture
,
but
I
think
they're
the
most
visible
part
and
the
one
that's
the
most
related
to
how
an
employee
experiences
a
company
culture
.
Um
,
and
that
kind
of
goes
back
to
why
I
think
that
facilitation
is
so
important
,
cause
I
think
,
if
you
,
if
you
,
I
mean
of
not
every
meeting
needs
to
be
a
workshop
,
right
,
but
I
mean
more
,
just
that
when
you
are
organizing
a
meeting
,
it's
,
it's
planned
,
it's
thought
through
workshop
participants
,
like
meeting
participants
,
figuring
out
exactly
how
,
how
it
needs
to
work
during
,
during
the
whole
thing
,
figuring
out
exactly
how
it
needs
to
work
during
the
whole
thing
and
creating
a
space
for
people
to
explore
and
then
,
on
the
flip
side
,
coming
to
a
decision
.
Speaker 2
16:18
I
mean
,
to
some
extent
this
is
similar
to
running
a
normal
meeting
,
but
when
you
move
it
into
an
online
environment
,
you
know
it
is
a
different
experience
than
when
you're
all
in
a
room
together
and
yeah
,
and
then
being
able
to
use
things
like
,
for
example
,
going
back
to
whiteboards
right
.
So
you've
got
people
.
There
could
be
one
person
talking
,
a
couple
of
people
updating
post-its
,
another
person
organizing
,
making
like
arrows
or
boxes
or
something
,
and
so
it's
like
this
multimedia
experience
.
Right
,
you've
got
the
visual
.
You've
got
things
moving
,
you're
touching
things
,
you're
moving
things
around
and
everyone's
doing
it
at
once
,
right
.
Speaker 2
16:59
Whereas
if
you
just
have
,
you
know
,
the
Brady
Bunch
style
Zoom
setup
and
you
know
one
person
speaks
for
a
minute
at
a
time
,
like
,
and
one
person
speaks
for
a
minute
at
a
time
,
most
people
are
going
to
be
disconnecting
because
it
just
doesn't
feel
as
relevant
.
They
don't
feel
like
they're
part
of
it
.
Whereas
if
you
really
create
a
space
where
people
can
all
take
action
at
the
same
time
and
talk
about
things
at
the
same
time
and
really
get
at
what's
the
actual
problem
we're
solving
?
How
are
we
going
to
do
it
Then
?
That
,
I
think
,
eventually
leads
to
a
much
better
experience
for
employees
,
but
also
better
outcomes
really
for
the
company
too
.
Speaker 1
17:42
Yeah
,
and
I
think
there's
a
lot
of
companies
,
not
just
the
ones
that
are
nearly
remote
,
but
even
existing
ones
,
that
are
continually
learning
how
to
do
things
,
how
to
you
know
how
to
work
best
,
and
there's
a
lot
of
collaboration
where
that's
concerned
.
Speaker 1
17:59
And
again
,
when
I
first
started
working
,
I
was
mostly
working
remotely
alone
.
A
lot
of
the
things
I
mean
,
obviously
working
,
working
alone
,
but
working
within
sort
of
different
,
collaborating
with
different
areas
and
different
people
a
lot
of
the
things
that
I
did
,
or
you
know
the
,
I
suppose
that
the
iti
used
,
or
the
,
I
suppose
the
,
the
ways
in
which
I
worked
.
I
I
learned
as
I
went
along
,
um
,
and
often
made
mistakes
myself
,
quite
big
mistakes
sometimes
,
and
there
came
a
point
actually
,
where
I
became
really
isolated
and
felt
like
I
was
just
sort
of
I
don't
know
stagnating
in
my
learning
.
And
it
was
only
through
,
I
suppose
,
in
a
way
by
accident
,
I
started
to
sort
of
reach
out
to
other
people
,
to
speak
to
them
and
learn
about
what
they
were
doing
,
and
in
fact
,
this
is
how
the
remote
work
life
podcast
came
about
through
those
conversations
,
and
that's
how
I
continue
to
learn
.
How
do
you
,
you
know
,
in
your
,
your
context
,
how
do
you
continue
with
your
learning
and
your
development
?
Speaker 2
19:13
your
sort
of
context
.
How
do
you
continue
with
your
learning
and
your
development
?
Yeah
,
yeah
,
I
mean
.
So
the
two
main
topics
that
I
focus
on
are
innovation
or
new
product
development
and
remote
work
,
and
I
think
,
in
terms
of
learning
,
I
think
the
really
useful
rule
of
thumb
that's
really
helped
me
a
lot
is
only
learning
things
that
are
directly
related
to
one
specific
thing
that
I'm
working
on
right
now
,
so
that
I'm
not
just
,
you
know
,
kid
in
a
candy
store
picking
up
all
these
little
interesting
tidbits
all
over
the
place
,
so
that
it's
related
to
something
that
I'm
actually
doing
,
that
I'm
actually
doing
Um
and
um
.
Yeah
,
I
mean
in
terms
of
the
,
the
,
the
practice
.
The
practice
,
I
mean
it's
,
it's
,
it's
,
you
know
,
usually
I'm
reading
,
I'm
listening
to
things
like
podcasts
or
audio
books
or
something
,
and
then
trying
to
figure
out
how
I
can
run
a
small
experiment
or
help
a
team
run
run
a
small
experiment
uh
around
around
the
thing
that
I'm
trying
to
solve
,
and
by
experiment
.
Speaker 2
20:15
It
doesn't
need
to
be
like
this
big
formal
thing
or
hypothesis
and
all
of
that
,
but
it's
more
like
if
I
make
a
small
change
,
how
is
that
going
to
change
how
the
team
works
,
how
things
are
going
to
happen
?
How
is
that
going
to
change
how
the
team
works
,
how
things
are
going
to
happen
?
So
,
for
example
,
one
of
my
favorite
series
of
experiments
were
around
meetings
and
doing
things
like
canceling
meetings
,
moving
to
completely
this
kind
of
operation
meeting
that
development
teams
have
,
moving
them
to
occasional
ones
,
moving
them
to
Slack-based
ones
,
all
kinds
of
iterations
around
that
and
getting
the
right
environment
for
that
particular
set
of
individuals
to
come
together
and
work
effectively
,
instead
of
telling
them
that
you
must
meet
at
1
pm
GMT
every
day
and
all
of
that
kind
of
thing
.
So
again
,
it's
around
creating
that
collaborative
environment
that
helps
them
work
together
and
finish
bits
of
work
quickly
,
effectively
.
Optimizing Meetings for Productivity and Engagement
Speaker 1
21:27
Talking
about
meetings
,
obviously
.
I
mean
,
meetings
are
,
yes
,
they're
important
,
but
it's
important
to
get
meetings
right
and
making
sure
that
you're
being
as
productive
as
you
can
without
,
like
you
said
,
the
zoom
,
the
zoom
,
doom
,
the
.
There's
so
much
,
so
many
things
,
so
many
uh
apps
you
can
use
to
meet
people
these
days
.
Aren't
there
so
many
that
you
can
use
that
literally
do
the
same
thing
?
But
you
see
and
you
hear
online
lots
of
people
complaining
about
how
,
how
often
they're
meeting
and
what
they're
talking
about
during
meetings
,
meetings
going
on
with
time
and
meetings
sort
of
basically
enveloping
the
whole
day
and
not
allowing
them
to
do
the
work
that
they
want
to
do
.
How
I
mean
,
I
don't
know
if
you
want
to
talk
about
Luke
,
how
you
do
it
within
,
again
,
within
your
context
,
but
how
do
you
,
how
do
you
go
about
making
making
sure
or
getting
the
meetings
right
for
you
and
your
team
?
Speaker 2
22:32
So
there
is
a
place
for
meetings
,
whereas
in
terms
of
deciding
things
and
coming
together
to
decide
really
important
things
that
need
to
happen
quickly
,
I
think
the
challenge
has
been
for
a
lot
of
companies
now
with
the
pandemic
,
with
the
large
amount
of
meetings
,
is
that
meetings
are
being
used
,
for
example
,
or
misappropriated
I
guess
is
the
word
right
so
using
for
tracking
status
,
whereas
you
can
,
or
kind
of
trying
to
create
deadlines
,
so
create
false
urgency
by
scheduling
a
meeting
on
Friday
so
that
a
piece
of
work
is
done
by
Friday
,
that
kind
of
thing
,
as
opposed
to
genuinely
being
used
to
come
together
and
decide
things
,
celebrate
things
.
And
there's
a
lot
of
work
which
is
done
into
meetings
which
,
in
fact
,
could
be
done
asynchronously
.
So
it
could
be
done
,
um
,
based
on
you
know
,
writing
something
up
,
uh
,
having
someone
else
look
at
it
,
you
know
,
more
email
,
more
like
it
doesn't
.
It
doesn't
need
to
all
always
be
,
uh
,
everyone
physically
getting
together
just
to
talk
about
every
little
detail
.
And
I
think
the
art
and
science
of
it
is
like
figuring
out
,
when
you
do
have
a
workflow
of
meetings
,
like
which
meetings
are
necessary
,
which
meetings
aren't
,
and
then
how
of
the
meetings
that
aren't
,
what
are
other
ways
or
better
ways
that
you
can
achieve
the
same
goal
without
organizing
a
meeting
or
a
regular
meeting
.
Basically
,
and
I
think
again
,
a
lot
of
this
goes
back
to
really
having
clear
objectives
,
because
if
you
have
that
and
then
you
take
each
meeting
,
you
know
,
you
go
through
your
Outlook
calendar
and
you
look
at
,
you
know
,
is
this
particular
meeting
helping
me
achieve
this
particular
objective
that
I
have
,
or
any
of
these
three
objectives
that
I
have
?
Speaker 2
24:55
First
of
all
,
do
we
need
it
at
all
if
we
don't
cancel
it
?
Obviously
,
if
we
still
need
something
about
it
,
is
there
another
way
of
achieving
that
?
So
just
having
people
you
what
they
did
today
,
for
example
,
or
this
week
or
something
,
if
it
is
status
right
?
So
coming
up
with
creative
ways
of
addressing
the
actual
business
need
without
necessarily
defaulting
to
a
meeting
.
And
yeah
,
it
does
require
a
good
amount
of
self-awareness
of
the
companies
and
the
individuals
in
the
companies
to
do
that
.
But
I
think
the
ones
who
do
get
it
right
.
You
know
you
can
have
most
of
most
of
the
week
relatively
free
of
meetings
and
if
you
know
,
particularly
when
we're
talking
about
,
you
know
within
a
larger
company
and
and
you
know
you're
organizing
the
work
like
you
,
I
don't
necessarily
think
you
need
that
many
.
But
again
,
it's
very
industry
context
specific
.
So
it
just
you
know
it's
case
by
case
basis
no
,
definitely
and
it
can
really
.
Speaker 1
26:02
I
mean
,
I've
spoken
to
people
who
can
really
snap
the
life
out
of
literally
set
the
life
and
energy
from
you
when
you're
going
from
one
meeting
to
another
and
,
um
,
speaking
to
somebody
the
day
who
will
remain
nameless
,
but
,
um
,
he
was
literally
spending
two
,
three
hours
,
sometimes
a
day
in
just
in
meetings
and
by
the
time
he'd
finished
.
Speaker 1
26:26
By
the
time
he'd
finished
the
meeting
he
was
so
exhausted
he
wasn't
able
to
do
,
wasn't
able
to
do
the
work
he
was
supposed
to
be
doing
,
or
at
least
he
wasn't
at
his
at
the
point
where
he
he
was
at
his
best
to
do
the
work
and
I
think
it
just
got
out
of
control
.
But
I
think
he's
getting
on
top
of
it
now
and
he's
.
I
gave
him
a
bit
of
advice
because
I
think
what
he
was
doing
was
,
um
,
he
actually
wasn't
sharing
his
calendar
.
I
think
people
were
just
booking
stuff
in
here
,
there
and
everywhere
and
into
literally
was
overlapping
with
his
um
,
with
his
work
time
.
So
he's
starting
to
get
a
solution
now
.
Speaker 1
26:59
But
I
know
there's
lots
of
people
out
there
who
are
really
struggling
and
it
can
,
like
I
said
,
it
can
really
take
the
life
out
of
people
and
you
can
take
the
fun
out
of
of
work
as
well
,
because
I
mean
,
you
can't
just
be
working
all
the
time
.
You
have
to
have
a
bit
of
downtime
,
it
has
to
be
a
bit
of
fun
,
you
know
,
because
that
that
,
after
all
,
is
,
is
what
helps
you
to
right
in
many
teams
,
in
many
cultures
not
just
not
all
cultures
but
it
can
help
to
really
bring
people
together
um
.
How
do
you
organize
your
team
or
a
team
?
How
would
you
recommend
organizing
a
team
so
that
it's
effective
,
engaged
and
fun
?
Speaker 2
27:38
So
I
think
,
in
terms
of
fun
,
I
think
fun
is
the
,
in
a
way
,
the
starting
point
.
So
I
think
usually
there's
a
number
of
things
that
the
team
is
aware
of
that
aren't
maybe
quite
so
fun
,
like
things
that
are
holding
them
back
.
And
,
again
,
coming
from
the
assumption
that
people
you
know
want
to
do
a
good
job
,
work
through
,
identify
all
of
those
things
,
put
them
in
one
place
,
on
a
shared
spreadsheet
or
on
some
kind
of
a
backlog
,
and
go
through
them
one
by
one
,
then
I
think
,
together
with
the
team
,
to
design
some
kind
of
a
process
for
how
they
do
the
work
,
so
that
they
get
real
time
information
as
to
how
they're
doing
so
.
So
what
I
mean
by
this
is
there's
,
um
I
guess
I'm
trying
to
think
um
,
how
to
do
it
in
a
,
in
a
non-software
way
or
a
non-manufacturing
way
,
I
mean
so
.
So
I
guess
the
way
that
I
think
about
it
is
that
you
have
a
unit
of
thing
that
,
if
you
want
to
create
something
like
I
don't
know
,
say
,
a
bicycle
,
how
do
you
how
quickly
you
can
get
the
whole
team
to
create
that
bicycle
?
Speaker 2
29:04
And
then
,
and
then
the
next
one
,
and
then
the
next
one
,
and
then
you've
got
a
time
of
how
long
it
takes
to
create
a
bicycle
,
right
,
so
that
bicycle
can
be
whatever
it
is
that
your
company
works
on
,
uh
,
and
then
that
gives
you
some
kind
of
a
number
that
everyone's
aware
of
it's
relatively
objective
.
And
then
that
gives
you
some
kind
of
a
number
that
everyone's
aware
of
it's
relatively
objective
,
and
then
you
can
use
it
to
help
work
with
the
team
in
a
fun
way
.
In
my
opinion
,
uh
,
maybe
,
maybe
,
maybe
I'm
biased
,
but
so
that
you
,
you
know
,
you
,
you
,
you
work
together
to
try
to
improve
how
long
it
takes
to
make
that
bicycle
,
try
to
improve
how
long
it
takes
to
make
that
bicycle
,
and
then
,
as
part
of
that
,
come
up
with
ways
of
you
know
,
automating
things
,
documenting
things
.
You
know
you
can
get
creative
in
terms
of
how
to
do
that
.
Speaker 2
29:57
And
yeah
,
that
I
mean
,
I
think
that's
that
combination
of
things
I
think
gets
people
engaged
and
,
in
fact
,
you
know
they
they
want
to
create
a
place
of
work
where
they
enjoy
working
,
and
I
think
it's
very
much
up
to
the
team
leader
to
to
organize
that
and
and
to
do
so
very
consciously
and
explicitly
,
and
I
think
that
combination
of
things
is
probably
a
way
to
do
exactly
that
.
Balancing Work and Productivity
Speaker 1
30:29
And
on
that
,
talking
about
work
,
and
obviously
and
I'll
talk
about
my
giving
you
my
example
of
the
guy
who
literally
has
his
life
slapped
from
him
from
all
his
meetings
and
it's
affected
and
it
overlaps
into
his
day-to-day
work
and
then
,
before
he
knew
it
,
the
work
he
was
supposed
to
have
done
on
that
day
was
going
into
the
next
day
,
and
so
on
and
so
forth
,
and
he
was
just
really
having
a
hard
time
.
He
he
was
struggling
with
his
productivity
.
Like
I
said
,
one
of
the
things
I
recommended
to
him
was
basically
get
his
diary
right
,
get
his
shared
calendar
right
and
setting
out
what
he
was
going
to
do
the
day
before
.
I
mean
all
the
basic
stuff
,
but
do
you
have
any
?
I
mean
,
why
do
companies
stuff
,
but
do
you
have
any
?
I
mean
,
why
do
companies
,
um
,
in
your
opinion
,
luke
,
uh
,
often
get
productivity
wrong
?
I
mean
,
it
was
a
big
example
that
I
gave
you
just
now
,
but
why
do
you
think
that
they
get
productivity
wrong
?
Speaker 2
31:34
so
I
think
,
just
off
the
back
of
the
example
that
you're
talking
about
,
I
mean
,
the
insight
that
I
find
really
useful
is
from
a
guy
named
Paul
Graham
,
who's
people
who
are
managers
and
who
like
being
managers
,
and
the
productivity
is
based
on
meetings
and
decisions
.
Then
there's
people
who
are
creative
and
they
create
things
and
they
work
on
things
,
and
I
think
a
lot
of
the
challenge
companies
have
is
because
the
two
sides
are
assuming
things
about
each
other
that
aren't
necessarily
true
.
So
,
uh
,
particularly
managers
assuming
that
people
who
want
to
do
want
to
do
the
work
right
.
So
this
is
essentially
a
discussion
of
getting
the
balance
right
between
doing
the
work
versus
thinking
about
the
work
.
Speaker 2
32:34
That
we're
talking
about
,
the
work
that
needs
to
be
done
,
and
usually
the
way
to
diagnose
this
,
in
my
opinion
,
is
to
basically
make
sure
there's
enough
time
to
actually
do
the
work
,
and
if
that
means
using
something
as
simple
as
a
time
block
in
Outlook
,
where
these
three
hours
don't
schedule
a
meeting
on
top
of
this
,
and
then
anyone
who
tries
to
say
no
,
right
,
so
set
that
boundary
,
so
then
you've
got
those
three
hours
where
you
can
go
and
actually
do
the
work
that
you
want
to
do
or
that
you're
expected
to
do
,
depending
on
the
context
,
or
others
are
expecting
you
to
do
At
the
same
,
the
same
time
you
do
.
Speaker 2
33:20
You
don't
want
to
completely
block
out
.
You
know
eight
hours
a
day
of
that
and
and
and
.
Just
go
off
into
your
own
little
corner
and
do
your
thing
,
because
what
you're
doing
if
you're
working
in
a
team
context
might
not
sync
well
with
what
everyone
else
is
doing
if
everybody's
sitting
in
their
own
corner
doing
their
own
thing
.
So
it
is
a
balance
right
.
And
I
think
,
yeah
,
looking
at
people's
calendars
when
you're
in
a
team
context
is
a
good
place
to
start
in
terms
of
having
that
discussion
and
getting
the
right
mix
there
.
Speaker 1
33:58
No
,
thank
you
.
It's
interesting
,
like
I
said
,
I
couldn't
believe
it
when
,
again
talking
about
this
guy
,
that
it
wasn't
really
the
.
They
just
started
working
remotely
but
they
weren't
used
to
it
,
to
be
fair
to
them
so
.
But
they
didn't
have
,
they
didn't
even
share
calendars
,
they
literally
didn't
share
anything
.
They
didn't
have
any
sort
of
cloud-based
things
like
drive
or
anything
like
that
that
they
were
using
.
It
was
just
all
desk
,
you
know
all
on
their
desktop
.
And
then
they
were
suddenly
into
a
situation
where
they're
having
to
change
all
their
working
practices
and
their
you
know
their
mindset
,
and
it
was
a
bit
of
a
panic
,
I
mean
.
I
think
they're
slowly
but
surely
getting
to
grips
with
it
and
making
their
way
through
it
.
I
mean
they're
doing
a
good
job
,
but
it
is
,
I
have
to
say
it's
taking
its
toll
.
But
no
,
luke
,
thank
you
so
much
.
Tell
us
a
bit
more
about
the
launch
tomorrow
and
what
you're
doing
at
the
moment
and
what
your
plans
are
for
the
foreseeable
future
sure
.
Speaker 2
35:03
So
,
uh
,
so
,
launch
tomorrow
is
kind
of
the
the
innovation
consulting
thing
that
I
did
.
Spinning
off
that
,
I
also
wrote
a
book
specifically
on
on
idea
testing
,
market
testing
.
Uh
,
initially
that
was
the
first
book
and
then
then
this
.
So
I
still
do
help
companies
with
that
.
Sometimes
it's
startups
,
sometimes
it's
larger
companies
where
there
are
larger
teams
that
need
to
be
run
,
and
yeah
.
And
then
Align
Remotely
is
kind
of
more
just
the
remote
work
stuff
.
The
second
book
and
yeah
,
so
it's
at
this
point
it's
all
kind
of
melded
into
one
to
be
,
honest
,
as
,
as
it
has
Enhancing Distributed Creativity in Remote Work
Speaker 2
35:46
for
many
people
.
Speaker 2
35:46
I
don't
think
I'm
unique
in
that
,
in
that
particular
,
in
that
particular
sense
,
um
,
but
yeah
,
I
mean
it's
uh
,
I
think
I
think
the
,
the
,
the
creativity
,
the
distributed
creativity
piece
is
the
one
that
people
find
reasonably
hard
,
and
I
think
that's
the
piece
that
I
think
is
really
where
I
feel
like
I'm
most
helpful
to
companies
at
the
moment
Figuring
out
how
to
get
groups
of
people
to
be
creative
when
they
,
when
they
can't
physically
be
together
in
in
one
workshop
room
.
So
so
,
yeah
,
that's
,
uh
,
that's
,
that's
pretty
much
uh
,
launch
tomorrow
.
Speaker 1
36:28
In
a
nutshell
,
and
you
can
find
launch
tomorrow
wwwlaunchtomorrowcom
.
I
definitely
recommend
having
a
look
at
that
.
We're
going
to
include
that
in
the
show
notes
as
well
.
But
,
luke
,
um
luke
shemaj
wants
to
say
thank
you
so
much
for
joining
me
today
on
the
remote
work
life
podcast
.
We're
looking
out
for
what
you're
doing
and
,
um
,
yeah
,
it's
been
been
great
having
you
today
.
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