RWL057 How to Revolutionize Remote Team Collaboration with Jen Dennard

Building Effective Remote Team Collaboration

Alex Wilson-Campbell

0:00

Hello everybody. This is Alex again from the Remote Work Life podcast, and I have yet another excellent guest with me today. I have Jen Dennard from Range. She's a co-founder of Range, in fact, and Range. They essentially help remote teams to work more effectively by keeping them in sync, and I think that's probably at the top of everybody's mind at the minute in terms of remote work and, uh, being in sync, especially if you are working in a situation that's probably a bit unusual to you. So, jen, I just wanted to thank you so much for joining me today on the remote work live podcast.

Jen Dennard

0:39

Thank you yeah, thank you so much for for having me.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

0:43

We're super excited to to chat and hear a little about your expertise as well excellent, yes, and we can uh talk a bit about me, but I want to learn lots more about you as well, lots more about range, because, in fact, I um, I think I thought this, this episode today, was really important because, as as I said, lots of people right now are working from home.

Jen Dennard

1:11

Definitely.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

1:11

Yeah, so the whole issue of working effectively is at the top of mind of everybody, and working effectively means different things to different people. But we're going to talk about uh in the middle of the show, in the, in the, in the sort of teachable section of the show, a method that you recommend and you use at um, at uh, at range. And the other thing about about you that really interested me today was because you you used to be, or you're usually a co-located team. Is that right?

Jen Dennard

1:53

Yeah. So, like many companies, we historically have been a mix of co-located and remote teammates, where the majority of our folks were at our San Francisco headquarters though we're 10 people, so headquarters with an asterisk and during the COVID-19 crisis we have shifted entirely to remote and even let go of our office space, so we are entirely office-less right now.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

2:11

All right, so you could completely shed your office. Then wow, that's even.

Jen Dennard

2:15

Yeah, we just moved out this week and, yeah, I think the the topic of team effectiveness is really top of mind for us and I'm glad you kind of highlighted that. Effectiveness means different things to different people. It sometimes can mean are you sitting in front of your zoom video the entire day so that I can watch what you're doing, which is not how range thinks about it, but happy to dive more into that as we get started no, yeah, and definitely.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

2:40

I'm also intrigued as well. I mean, we wanted you on here because we wanted to know about Range. But what about you? Tell us about you. How did you get to Range, to becoming a co-founder of Range? Because I see you have a mixed background. You've done some teaching, you've done some management consulting and you've been in people ops so a great blend of skills there that have brought you to be now um co-founder of range.

Jen Dennard

3:06

tell us how you got to to to arrange yeah, I, I think, like many people you know, when you you look back at your, your background, you're like, huh, I did do a variety of things, but they all kind of made sense at the time.

Jen Dennard

3:19

I'm originally from a manufacturing town in georg, the United States, and so grew up in kind of a very different world from Silicon Valley and ended up out here after kind of graduate school in political economy and doing some financial consulting and was really interested in this question of how you build an effective culture and an effective company and started doing some consulting with companies kind of from the YCs of the world or kind of much larger tech companies as well, and ended up going in house at a company called Medium, which is a blogging platform where I led our organization design and where I met one of my co-founders, dan. He was leading engineering at the time and ended up teaming up with our third co-founder, brayden, who's out of Google Ventures. No-transcript. A shift towards more innovation and autonomy on the teams, where individuals are making more decisions, an increased need for strong, high bandwidth communication, caring about culture and engagement, and we really saw a gap between those needs and the tools that teams were using, and that's what led us to build the team success platform that is Range today.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

4:55

No, it sounds good and yeah, it's like you said. I think that that blend of skills, but also those, the insight as well, that you get, not just from building it, but it's you've lived, sounds like you've actually lived the actual the experiences that you're talking about, which is always, uh, helpful when you're trying to build something that is useful, um, but no, it's, it's a great blend. And you tell me a bit more about your time at Medium, because Medium is something that's really taken off over the last few years or so.

Jen Dennard

5:29

Yeah, I think what's really interesting is different companies operate under different management philosophies and I think sometimes we forget that working remote is not a management philosophy, it is just a like fact about the way in which we are working. And one of the unique aspects about Medium when I was there was that we were transitioning from something called holacracy, which is a very specific way of operating that I would say like helpfully skeptical of. It has some really strong values that I align with things around empowering teammates, having clear, intentional process, though I am more skeptical of the specific way in which Holacracy implements it. But for me it was a really really rich learning environment to understand new ways of operating and to incorporate those into my own experiences.

Jen Dennard

6:20

As you were saying, and that's one of the things that is, I think, quite unique about Range and the software that we build. We are not just saying, hey, here's how Google or here's how Airbnb does something and we're going to implement that in the software and tell everyone to do it. Lots of different types of companies, including nursing or medium or large companies like Google and Airbnb, along with research from organizational psychologists and management work and things of that nature, to actually build a product that is intentional in how it guides people, and so, yeah, we are definitely a process nerd and an org nerd, which I'm sure will be apparent, if it's not already, by the end of this podcast no, it's just exactly what we wanted for the podcast, so don't worry about that.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

7:09

That's brilliant. No, I think, um, it's an interesting story, but the other thing is an interesting method of working. Like you said, uh, and like you said everything, all of these different building blocks have basically shaped you into this, this, uh, this great business business that is range at the moment. And I suppose the other thing is I want to find out about you, jen, before we move on is what was really the motivation for you behind setting up range? Yeah, what was the motivation?

Jen Dennard

7:51

setting up range. Um, yeah, what was the motivation? Yeah, I, I think when we first started range, there were a couple different factors for the team at large and then for myself. So we saw this honestly this waste of human capital, or humans in terms of the experience at work. So having people kind of grinding out their lives day to day in jobs where they were not enjoying themselves and where they were not realizing their own full potential, and nor were the companies. They were kind of struggling to fix their culture, fix these different problems, and what we saw in the market was a lot of people doing surveys or things to better understand what was going on, but not solve the root problems underlying these issues.

Jen Dennard

8:32

And what we see is that that's really an operational item is how you work together as a team predicts how much fun you're having at work and whether you're having an impact, all the things that predict your mental wellbeing, and so that was a really key, key reason for us to start the company and I think for myself personally, it's been. An added nuance to that is the integration of work and being a person that, like we have emotions, we have feelings when we talk to people and I have to deal with you know my fiance yelling on his work call right now or things like that and I felt that, growing up kind of around more traditional businesses, this separation of who you are from who you can be at work felt really disingenuous to me and I feel like there was this big opportunity for work to be a more humane place and that having software that nudges you in that direction can be a really powerful way to drive broad change, versus kind of one-on-one coaching or things like that. That can be a little bit slower.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

9:31

no, I hear that, um, and yeah, there is a bit a big, I suppose push now, or at least a, a culture shift, I guess you could say in in terms of like the whole idea of of who you are at work and who you are in life there's almost like a merging of the sort of the boundaries I suppose you could say, because it used to be like you said, and even you could go back a few years ago and even now it still.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

9:58

It still happens to this day, but where you've got, you know, a different persona at work and a different persona when you get home, and I think that was part I share, that. That same sort of that was my. One of my pushes, actually was actually what you just mentioned in terms of I felt as though I was really sort of a had to be a different person almost in those two scenarios. So, yeah, well, thank you, thank you for sharing that with us. Thank you. What I want to know is what, as I said we, we were talking about, uh, remote work today and, as you said at the top of the call, you said, um, that you're now fully remote. How has that been? How has that sort of transition been for you over the last few weeks?

Jen Dennard

10:40

yeah, I think. I think it's a mixed bag. Uh, I am, I'm not a parent, so it's been a relatively easy transition for me. We had been working some remote, so it took a little bit of like setting up an office space. I mean, I'm calling in from a three by six closet that I use as an office and I am a petite person, so it actually works out. But you know, I'm in a quasi studio, one bedroom in San Francisco. We just don't have that much space.

Jen Dennard

11:10

So that's probably been the biggest challenge for me personally, though we have obviously teammates who have, you know, several children, and so that's a big shift in how how they are working, and so we've had to adapt our working style to accommodate people's availability at different times, which I think we'll get to in kind of the teachable moment related to windowed work.

Jen Dennard

11:35

But what's been interesting is to think through the lens of how you break down the workday into moments where you have collaboration, moments where you have focus time, moments where you get to socially connect, and how you can architect that routine for yourself and for the team, which sometimes happens, naturally, in an office space where you share that physical kind of moment and instead, with remote. You have to create that and I think we've done some of that intentionally and obviously had a great deal of experience with it due to our product. But, like any team, we've had growing pains and have had moments where it's like, oh, we just need to hop on a call because we are annoying each other and we should probably talk this out. So I think it's starting to stabilize some, but I think it's significantly harder for different people on the team based on their personal circumstance.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

12:24

Definitely, and I had a call last week with Laurel Farrow. We were talking just about the very same thing, in the sense that it's different for different people. Each person's experience is different, especially. I mean, this is even more amplified now, isn't it? Because there are no alternatives to being at home. Well, there are alternatives, but you know. Well, there are alternatives, but you know, the main area of work is is in the work is in the home. So I think, uh, by the sounds of it, you're taking an approach where, uh, you, you're um, I suppose you it sounds like you're very empathetic towards the rest of your team and you're trying to help each, each member of your team with their different circumstances.

Jen Dennard

13:16

Yeah, I think one of the aspects of inclusion that I find really important in the workplace and my background related to consulting with companies is often around diversity and inclusion is meeting people where they are, that not everything actually has to be the same for everyone. So some people working from you know nine to five is actually ideal. That's how their personality works. They prefer that structure. Some people are dealing with kids, and so working two hours 11 to one and two hours here like that actually is quite effective for them, and so the the real need is to align around what time you do need to work together.

Jen Dennard

13:51

Uh, similar to how companies are figuring out how to have some people in the office If their work is, you know, physical based or they need to have people there. I think there's this, this transition that we're all making of like okay, what work needs to be overlapping or needs to be physical location or physical office, versus what can be done at home or on off hours where we're independent from one another, and I'm happy to talk through more specifically kind of what we mean by windowed work and how we apply that at range.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

14:19

Yeah, I'm looking forward to that segment actually because I'm going to learn a thing or two myself. I'm looking forward to that segment actually because I'm going to learn a thing or two myself. And, like I said before, if you're listening now, well, when you're listening now and you're trying to figure out you're a manager, you're trying to figure out yourself how best to, I guess, help your team to be at their most effective. I think this is is really something I've not heard of, heard of it put in the in the sort of term as windowed work, but this is something that I think could really be useful to you. So keep listening. Just one one, one more question before we get onto that section. I mean, have your views of remote work changed at all since, since the actual, since the whole?

Jen Dennard

15:03

I was just speaking with someone about this this morning. I think I think for many people, and myself included, it's been an aha moment where you realize that when you put in the effort and the intention, remote work can be just as effective as working together in person assuming, of course, you're in a situation where you are able to do your work over a computer or at home. What I think has been an interesting learning is, when we say work, what do we mean? We often think it's the tasks associated with getting work done or moving the project forward. But really work is this experience that we all share together, and it includes getting tasks and projects done. It includes joking about the most recent sports game or the crazy TV show that's happening, like Tiger King. It includes being creative and coming up with ideas or projects. It is this whole encompassing experience, and I think the initial shift to remote work for many teams was how do we just do the tasks separately? How do we ensure that we collaborate on the tasks? And what is now becoming a clear understanding is how do we capture that whole work experience? How do we ensure that we collaborate on the tasks? And what is now becoming a clear understanding is, how do we capture that whole work experience? How do we create the truly remote office instead of just the remote task management software? And that's obviously why we built Range to help facilitate that.

Jen Dennard

16:28

But it's definitely, I think, been an aha moment still for me to be like, oh, there's all these different moments. I think been an aha moment still for me to be like, oh, there's all these different moments. And it is, I think, worth recognizing that everyone isn't just experimenting with working from home right now. We are experiencing a global pandemic and being forced to stay home and work, and that's very different from a normal situation where you're able to work from home and you can go to coffee shops, you can potentially have your kids be actually at school or things of that nature, and so I think those two things are very entangled and kind of enmeshed with one another right now. But it's definitely been an aha moment for what is possible and also what we may still need to grow on love that, absolutely love that.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

17:11

yeah, it's um, it is. I think lots of people before they started doing remote work I'm not necessarily saying this to you, but that they they had probably preconceived ideas of what it was and it's. It's probably changed and well, I've been working remotely myself for a few years for a few years, and it's not just about productivity.

Implementing Windowed Work for Remote Teams

Alex Wilson-Campbell

17:37

All the conversations seem just about how much work you can get done when you can get it done. But it's like you said, it's about all the things that contribute to that and it's creating, you know, the right atmosphere and getting the right people together. And you know the tools just actually support that, don't they? And so, yeah, I love that little piece there. I'm going to be using that for my little segment, so I love that. But let's move on, jen, shall we? Because this is a bit I really wanted to know more about myself and share with the Remote Work Life audience. And that is how can we? I mean, I've got three children myself, so I've been through even you know, recently I was explaining to you, before we got on the call, how it's. It's changed for me, obviously, having to manage my children as well as stay, you know, consistent with my work. And there's this idea of windowed work that you talked about, and I would love to know more about that. What is windowed work? Tell us more about it.

Jen Dennard

18:46

Yeah, so windowed work actually came out of, I think, my co-founder's experience being a father and having to he actually just had his second child as the coronavirus epidemic was kind of starting and so really kind of came out of his experience and pushed range to accommodate that and to rethink how we were working. And what we saw was that this idea of kind of the nine to five or nine to midnight, depending on your company working day is in many ways a holdover from all needing to be in manufacturing and that is an extremely powerful way to do work when you kind of need to all be collaborating on it, physically or at the same time. But in kind of knowledge work it's often the case that there's a mix of different types of work. So you have moments where you are collaborating with someone like this, where we are creating something together. You also have moments where you are heads down on an individual task, moving it forward, where you are sketching out that specific design and kind of ideating on your own, or you are executing on kind of the company financials and finalizing those to share out, and those moments are less collaborative.

Jen Dennard

20:14

You kind of are just your own kind of autonomous unit doing that and what we found is that those don't all need to be one after the other throughout the day, and so the principle of windowed work is that you can have specific time set aside for collaboration. Like, here is my zone, like 11 am to 3 pm. Those are the hours where I'm specifically available for collaboration with others. That's when I can attend meetings, that's when you can ping me and expect an immediate response. Now there's another set of hours which are kind of the second zone, where I'm working but I'm also potentially distracted a bit. So like when you are, you know, caring for a child but also answering some Slack messages, that kind of in-between world where you're like cool and so people can expect a delayed response and you may be collaborating. You're probably doing some work independently, or you made it a little bit of support, et cetera.

Jen Dennard

21:11

And then there's moments, of course, where you're completely offline. You are dealing with your personal life, for just doing the things that are not work related, or you just need focus time on something that you specifically need to set aside time where you don't want to be in communication with others, because you need to focus, and our kind of realization was that allowing people to set up their own cadence for that during the week or during the day is really powerful in terms of inclusion. It allows people who are parents to set up that structure and allows you to align the different times. So we really strongly recommend starting out by writing it down, so being like cool, you've got a 15 person team. What are people's different schedules? Like somebody has to take care of their kids in the morning and then they hand off to their partner, or someone is caring for a family member, or things of that nature, and so how do you align where?

Jen Dennard

22:04

Okay, every week, these are our three meetings that everyone has to attend and that we need to make work so that we can get the planning, the collaboration, the retroing all done and then help raise empathy for people's schedules outside of that. So it's really helpful because when I ping one of my coworkers, I know that he has specific hours. He's online, but the other hours are mixed because he is caring for his child, and so that changes my expectations. It also changes how I plan my work, because I know that if I need to collaborate and I need something from someone else, there's a specific set of hours where I can do that, so I can't be pinging someone at 11 PM being like, hey, can you send me this thing Just because I happen to be working. Instead, that time needs to be during a specific overlap, and I think that intentionality shifts how we work and just shifts expectations. But once you've done that, it makes it really easy and really natural and it's much less stressful than being pinged all day to collaborate or to engage with others.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

23:05

No, it's good as well that you've this is something that you've. Is this something that you've recently instilled into the practice, or is that? Were you sort of heading in that direction? Anyway, was that is it? Was it all prompted by the, the whole remote work?

Maximizing Remote Team Collaboration Success

Jen Dennard

23:21

it's been something that we've done, I would say informally. Um, since we got started, you know, we have been always been a flexible workplace, very not a like butts in seats place, and so it was pretty common for someone to be like, oh, I'm going to work from home this afternoon or I've got to hop off to this doctor's appointment, or something of that nature. Our team is a big fan of therapy, which I think you know, hopefully spreads to the whole world. But I think what has come with COVID-19 is a formalization of that process and much more documentation, because there are just much more things going on that people need to handle and I think that kind of reduces people anxiety to share what's happening and helps raise empathy for it, instead of just having the miscommunication where you're trying to get information from someone and they're not responsive or things of that nature. And yeah, so I would say it's been a practice, but the formalization has been more recent.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

24:23

And you mentioned the documentation of that. So does that mean you're Okay, so you've got your? How does that? Yeah, tell me about your documentation. I don't want to second guess with how you go about that. How does that work?

Jen Dennard

24:53

Like that doesn't work super well and, to some extent, is what's happening when you don't write it down Right that someone is offline because they needed to get groceries, which is it's like own ordeal right now, and what we found was that writing individual handbooks where it's like here's how to work with Jen.

Jen Dennard

25:10

Here is her, here are her top priorities that she focuses on, here are the times that she's available for collaboration. Here are other things that you might need to know, like I, for instance, shared that I have hip problems and I'm getting hip surgery in a few weeks, and so that means that sometimes I need to walk around, because sitting all in the same position is difficult for a long period of time, and so if I asked to do a one-on-one walking or kind of on the phone instead, like that's what's underlying that and that's the type of things that we include in our handbook beyond just working hours, that really helps create a level of empathy and understanding for what's going on in someone's life. That allows you to then better work effectively together. And yeah, that's kind of a key part part. We have a few other things that we kind of recommend to do that well and help make it not a chaotic situation no, I love the idea of the handbook and it's it's many of the best remote teams anyway.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

26:09

They they document things so that they're readily available, freely available. It sounds like you guys are taking to it like a duck to water in terms of your uh, your transition from from co-located to remote. But I love that idea of creating individual handbooks so each person within the team can see when, where or what somebody else is doing at any given time. I love that, really do yeah and okay. And another thing you mentioned is before I, because there are four steps of windowed work, which, which you mentioned before, but before that you mentioned something about you guys believe in, in fact sorry, let me take another step back that is a real stress reliever. That like takes a lot. I can imagine that takes a lot of anxiety away from a lot of different people, because not only are they sort of their work is set up in a way that suits them, but everybody else can see what they're doing and it kind of manages people's expectations, doesn't it? In terms of who's available, when or what X person is doing at any given time, right?

Jen Dennard

27:21

Yeah, I think one of the big things at work is uncertainty and feeling like you have a sense of your work and also like what's expected of you.

Jen Dennard

27:33

And I think during especially a time like this where there's a lot of things going on and the mental health of a lot of people on the team is being impacted, just knowing that you have a routine and clear expectations of when and how to communicate really just makes it easier for the team to show up each day, versus having to make the decision every day of how am I going to try to attend this meeting, how am I going to try to attend this meeting, how am I going to try to answer email during this specific time.

Jen Dennard

28:01

Like that, those types of decisions add up right. It's decision fatigue, which is a well-researched phenomenon, and it's also just on top of everyone dealing with the personal impact of COVID-19 on their families, on loved ones, on all of those things. And so I think what we can do to help our teams have routines to help them plan their day and focus is a gift. It's not just about helping them be more effective or productive from a work standpoint. It's about helping them have an easier time showing up in the world each day love it.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

28:35

What are the four steps, then, that you say will help windowed work to work?

Jen Dennard

28:42

Yeah. So, as I said, I think step one is like write it down, have a handbook, have a way in which you're documenting the intent, which also will help you flesh out any misalignment. Like if someone's like I will collaborate for this 15 minutes and I'm offline the rest of the day, it might be like, okay, that wasn't my expectation. So it helps to prompt those conversations in a in a deep, personalized way. Step two is really around the day-to-day experience. So we found that having a moment to check in with the team is really important. So we encourage asynchronous check-ins. So we do that through range, which is a one of our features, is a check-in product where you do a daily stand-up of sorts, where you share what you're planning to do, what you did yesterday, and you take a moment to connect personally with the rest of the team helpful for lowering the bar, for communicating about what's going on and giving room for these chaotic opportunities for collaboration. So it's really hard for me to know that you're working on something that I might be able to help with or something that overlaps with my work, if I don't know what you're doing. And so daily check-ins, which have been used by product dev teams for years now are starting to spread to a lot of different types of teams, because it just helps have that moment of alignment. The next step is around connection. So with doing windowed work, it's easy to start to feel disconnected. So one of the advantages of all being in the office nine to five is that you are inherently connecting with each other socially. Like you can't not talk to each other and when you are working at a different hours it's easy to miss the beat a little bit or to have those moments of misalignment or feeling lonely, and so we recommend scheduling in specific connection time and you can do that in different ways that meet the person where they are. Maybe it's a fun Slack channel where you share gifts or have specific structured conversation there, or it can be things like having a specific coffee in the morning, like 9am every day is an optional moment to check in with each other, or at the end of the day. That's part of what our team does and it's been really meaningful because you get to interact with people you don't normally. There are certain people that on the team I have meetings with regardless. We're always going to touch base because we have to work together a lot, whereas there are other people who I mostly saw in the context of an office, and so having social moments can be really powerful there.

Jen Dennard

31:15

The last item is really about, I think to circle back to the point you made around how to be effective while working remote and generally how to be effective as a team, and that relates more to goals. So if you've kind of got the habit of you're like, hey, we've written down what we're going to do, we're checking in on our work day to day, we're feeling connected, then the question is like are you all going the right place together? Then the question is like are you all going the right place together? Like one of the things that is true about particularly innovation oriented work is that you're often dynamically steering and not changing direction, but you know turning a little bit.

Jen Dennard

31:49

And what is true is that can be harder when you aren't connecting as much or you don't have as much collaboration time, because you can be focused on just getting that next item out. And so one of the things that we recommend is taking time to really invest in your goals and invest in ensuring that those are the right ones and that you are tracking them and checking in on them regularly, and that's again, of course. Another feature in range is the connection from your daily check-ins to these longer-term goals, so that you're actually pushing that work forward and you know that you're pushing the right work. Part of the thing is you can say, okay, here was our goal pre-COVID-19, but now we had to shift, so what should it be now? And that, I think, really is about the longevity of windowed work in an effective way to work together for the long-term term, not just for a few weeks that's wonderful.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

32:40

and, talking about range, I recommend going across to rangeco to have a look at uh, what jen um and daniel daniel pupius, your co-founder yeah dan pup, dan Pupias and Braden Coates.

Jen Dennard

32:58

Yeah, dan is also British, so he would appreciate that.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

33:02

Dan Pupias, have a look to see what they're doing. It looks like to me something that you know. You get lots of tools on the market right now and lots of people are pushing tools, but it's always good to talk to the people behind the tools to see what their philosophies are, the way they think, and that's why I wanted to have Jen on here today and it just sounds like you know, um, range is all about not just the actual mechanics of of work, it's about people it's. It's about trying to put people first and trying to make essentially people's lives easier, you know, so that they their whole life essentially can can be easy, not just the work aspect. So go across to rangeco and Jen, tell me before we wrap up you've got clients, like Twitter, you've got Medium, you've got Mozilla what does the future look like for range?

Jen Dennard

33:59

you've got Medium, you've got Mozilla.

Embracing Remote Work Evolution

Jen Dennard

34:00

What does the future look like for Range? Yeah, I think we are really excited about this aha moment that everyone is having. I think we are glad that so many people are kind of interested in the remote work world right now. Obviously, we would have never in any wildest imagination wanted it to happen in this way, but what is powerful, we think, is this aha moment that people are having, and what we are excited about is this shift towards understanding people and how we work together and that advent, I think, for Range. We have several features in terms of check-ins and objectives and I'm really excited about that as a true work from home tool that people can use to make it feel like we're working in an office and that we have those still moments of social connection and engagement with one another. And it's just been really exciting for us to see a lot more teams start to use Range and see their experience with it and, you know, of course, also excited to get back outside and do things that, uh, we all like to do when we can.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

35:03

So kind of the the nuance there of still excited for the normal world like the rest of everyone well, one thing is for certain we will be keeping an eye on range, rangeco, uh, to see where you're going, what you're doing, uh, what you and dan are doing with range and I want to thank you for going and what you're doing, what you and Dan are doing with range. Jen, I want to thank you for joining me today on the remote work live podcast and, yeah, all the best with to you and Dan for range for the future.

Jen Dennard

35:28

Thanks so much, and thank you so much for having me looking forward to chatting for better.

Alex Wilson-Campbell

35:32

Will do. Thanks, Jen.