RWL225: How a Life-Changing Trip Led to Founding Kodebusters and Remote Work Success w/ Gleb Gordeev

Location Independent Businesses With Gleb Gordeev

Alex Wilson-Campbell
0:00

You're

thinking

about

starting

your

own

location

independent

business
?

Well
,

today's

guest

did

just

that
.

He's

an

entrepreneur
,

product

expert

and

mentor
,

as

well

as

being

an

athlete

and

aspiring

surfer
.

His

name

is

Gleb

Gordeev

and

for

the

past

eight

years
,

he's

built

products

used

by

millions

of

people

across

40

plus

countries

plus

countries
.

He's

managed

software

projects

with

hundreds

of

people

and

complex

stakeholder

setups
,

from

startups

to

large

international

corporations
.

Today

he

runs

Codebusters
,

building

awesome

products

for

startups

and

enterprises

from

idea

to

launch

in

30

days
.

His

process

includes

discovery
,

prototyping
,

no-code

development

and

go-to-market

strategies
.

He

manages

agency

growth

and

a

team

of

product

managers
,

designers

and

developers
.

Gleb

is

also

a

huge

advocate

for

the

future

of

work

and

wealth
.

He's

been

working

remotely

from

spectacular

places

for

the

last

three

years

and

he's

a

surf

and

fitness

addict

and

personal

growth

enthusiast
.

Welcome

Gleb
.

Gleb Gordeev
1:11

Hi

Alex
,

my

name

is

Gleb
,

I'm

31

and

I'm

an

entrepreneur
.

I'm

a

fitness

nerd
,

I'm

a

surfer
,

an

athlete
,

I

love

traveling

and
,

of

course
,

I

love

digital

nomad

lifestyle

as

well
.

Originally
,

I'm

coming

from

Russia

and

I've

been

living

in

Germany

for

almost

nine

years
.

This

is

where

I

built

my

career

in

product

management
.

I've

been

working

in

leading

technology

companies

in

Europe
,

both

international

corporations

but

also

startups
,

so

this

is

where

I

got

the

passion

for

technology
.

And

right

now

I'm

based

in

Bali
,

Indonesia
,

and

I'm

running

my

own

product

development

agency
,

which

is

called

Codebusters
,

where

me

and

my

team

we

bring

products

like

EVPs
,

startups
,

scale-ups
,

also

internal

apps

and

also

business

apps

for

enterprises
,

so

we

build

them

from

idea

to

launch

in

four

weeks
,

leveraging

our

product

management

experience
,

low-code
,

low-code

technology

and

also
,

of

course
,

ai

and

automation
.

And

my

free

time

I

love

surfing
,

as

I

said
,

traveling
,

learning
,

exploring

new

things

and
,

of

course
,

listening

to

podcasts

like

this

one
,

meeting

inspiring

people
,

and

I'm

really

lucky

to

be

surrounded

by

them
.

So
,

yeah
,

I'm

all

about

living

to

the

full

potential
.

Alex Wilson-Campbell
2:35

And

what

made

you

choose

to

work

at

the

company

that

you're

at

at

the

moment
.

Gleb Gordeev
2:39

I've

been

employed

by

truly

amazing

companies

and

I

had

good

salary
,

good

working

conditions

and

a

good

team
,

but

I

was

always

feeling

that

I

want

something

else
.

Gleb Gordeev
2:49

So

this

is

how

I

stepped

into

entrepreneurship
,

and

this

is

also

the

reason

why

I'm

running

my

company

right

now
,

together

with

two

local

founders

to

have

the

freedom

of

time
,

the

freedom

of

space
,

and

also

to

feel

that

I'm

building

something

for

myself
.

I'm

on

the

mission
,

and

this

understanding

that

I'm

on

the

mission

onto

something

big

this

is

something

which

motivates

me

to

work

every

single

day
,

even

though

it's

way

harder

work

than

to

work

in

the

company
.

Still
,

I've

never

been

more

fulfilled

than

now
,

work-wise
,

as

I

said
,

even

though

it's

a

lot

of

stress

as

a

business

owner
.

But

yeah
,

I

believe

we

are

doing

amazing

things
.

I

am

working

with

very

talented

people
,

we

are

empowering

businesses

and

entrepreneurs

to

ship

better

products

and
,

in

the

end
,

I

think

the

whole

market

wins

right
,

because

the

more

better

products

we

have
,

the

better

is

the

offer

for

end

users
.

So

this

is

why

I

truly

enjoy

to

do

what

I

do
.

Alex Wilson-Campbell
3:57

Describe

a

personal
,

notable

story

or

experience

that's

influenced

who

you

are

today
.

Gleb Gordeev
4:04

Oh
,

wow
.

I

could

really

name

a

lot

of

them
.

I

would

say

the

one

which

comes

to

mind

is

that

when

I

discovered

remote

work

for

the

first

time
,

it

was

in

early

2021
,

during

COVID
.

I

went

to

the

Spanish

island

of

Lanzarote

and

this

is

where

I

met

Digital

Nomads

for

the

first

time
,

and

I

was

there

on

two

weeks

vacation

I

think

it

even

was

like

10

days

and

I

saw

these

people

who

live

there

the

whole

winter
,

enjoying

the

life
,

surfing
,

dealing

the

community
,

and

ask

them

hey

guys
,

but

we're

coming

back
,

so

we're

not

coming

back
,

we

live

here
.

It's

like
,

wow
,

what

about

your

boss
?

Like

yeah
,

whatever
,

maybe

they

don't

know
,

maybe

they

know
,

but

it

doesn't

matter
,

because

we

really

enjoyed

the

lifestyle

here
.

Gleb Gordeev
4:48

And

this

was

one

of

many

aha

moments

for

me
,

when

I

realized

that

I

don't

have

to
,

that

I

can

really

enjoy

my

work

life

as

well

If

I

decide

where

to

live

and

what

to

do

after

work
.

And

once

I

started

to

prioritize

what

I'm

actually

doing

after

work
,

it

really

changed

my

life

dramatically

and

this

has

also

brought

me

where

I

am

now
.

There

were

many

stories

like

that
.

There

were

many

signs
,

like

omens
,

which

I've

seen

right
,

many

influential

discussions
,

many

influential

meetings
,

but

this

is

something

which

maybe

was

the

first

one

and

the

one

which

comes

to

my

mind
.

So

the

moment

when

I

discover

that

it's

actually

possible

to

work

from

anywhere

and

to

do

whatever

you

want

and

enjoy

your

life

outside

of

work
,

what

are

your

aspirations

for

your

career

going

forward
?

Gleb Gordeev
5:42

My

number

one

goal

right

now

is

to

scale

my

business
,

so

I'm

building

a

lifestyle

business
.

It

means

that

I

don't

really

have

a

mission

right

now

to

change

the

world
.

I

think

I

can

do

it

later
.

At

this

point

of

my

life
,

I

want

to

build

a

cash

flow

machine

that

is

going

to

support

my

life

so

I

can

be

free
,

I

can

choose

when

to

work
,

how

to

work

and

for

how

long
.

So

this

is

my

number

one

priority

for

now
.

I'm

still

exploring

some

other

ideas
.

Of

course
.

They

always

come

to

me

about

launching

different

products
.

I'm

also

exploring

opportunities

here

in

Bali
,

but

my

business

Codebusters

is

my

main

priority
.

I

want

explore

opportunities

here

in

Bali
,

but

my

business

Codebusters

is

my

main

priority
.

I

want

to

scale

it

to

the

point

which

will

cover

way

beyond

my

costs

of

living

and

give

me

the

financial

freedom
.

This

is

my

main

aspiration
.

It's

2024
.

Alex Wilson-Campbell
6:34

As

you

look

back

on

your

life

and

connect

the

dots

that

led

to

where

you

are

now
.

What

are

those

dots
?

Gleb Gordeev
6:42

I

can

identify

three
,

I

would

say
,

from

the

recent

story
.

So

the

first

one

is

already

mentioned

when

I

discovered

that

I

can

be

independent

from

location
,

where

I

found

out

that

I

can

work
,

for

I

don't

have

to

work

from

rainy
,

cold

Berlin

the

whole

winter

and

suffer

from

that
.

This

was

the

first

aha

moment
.

The

second

aha

moment

was

when

I

quit

alcohol

and
,

even

though

it's

not

related

to

business

and

career
,

the

impact

of

this

decision

was

dramatic

in

all

aspects

of

my

life
.

It

also

freed

up

a

lot

of

time

for

me

to

really

deal

with

my

demons
,

I

would

say
,

and

really

identify

who

am

I
,

what

I

want

in

life
,

and

there

are

many
,

many

benefits

health

benefits
,

mental

health

benefits
,

but

also

career-wise
.

This

was

the

moment

when

I

had

so

much

clarity
,

when

I

started

to

have

so

much

clarity
.

Gleb Gordeev
7:41

And

I

think

the

third

dot

is

when

I

fully

embraced

and

committed

to

this

lifestyle

which

I

have

right

now
.

When

I

permanently

moved

to

Bali

and

when

I

opened

my

first

company
,

I

made

a

clear

statement

for

myself

and

I

made

a

clear

statement

for

the

world

that

this

is

my

life

right

now

and

I'm

going

to

walk

my

talk
.

And

I

finally

reached

this

integrity

inside

me

because

in

the

beginning

I

was

always

like
,

when

I

was

working

and

building

my

career

in

product

management

corporate
,

I

was

always

feeling

that

I

don't

belong

here
.

And

when

I

stepped

to

this

path

of

difficult

path

of

entrepreneurship
,

I

was

finally

feeling

like

I'm

home
.

So

yeah
,

these

three

dots

and

they're

still

coming

and

coming
,

but

these

three
,

I

would

say
,

were

the

most

defining

Figuring

out

that

life

is

more

than

going

to

the

office
,

removing

all

the

necessary

things
,

starting

with

alcohol
.

And

third

one
,

committing

to

this

new

life

which

I

have
.

Alex Wilson-Campbell
8:46

What

made
?

Gleb Gordeev
8:48

you

choose

this

particular

profession
.

I

chose

to

be

a

product

manager

because

this

role

combines

my

unique

advantages
,

I

would

say
,

and

my

unique

background
.

I

studied

computer

science

and

informatics

university

and

I

was

always

fascinated

by

technology

and

by

how

software

can

solve

problems
.

But

I

was

also

very

active

in

my

ex-curricular

activities

when

I

was

a

student
.

I

was

organizing

events
,

conferences
,

I

was

traveling

a

lot

and

also

volunteering

as

a

student
,

so

I

developed

these

communication

skills

and

I

learned

a

bit

of

project

management

from

my

volunteering

experience
.

Gleb Gordeev
9:26

And

basically
,

when

I

just

started

my

career
,

I

think

this

role

was

a

perfect

match

for

my

background

and

my

personal

skills

and

I'm

really

grateful

because

I

started

my

career

in

Mercedes-Benz

in

Germany

and

my

first

boss

she

gave

me

a

chance

and

I'm

still

grateful

for

that
,

because

this

is

where

I

learned

about

product

management
,

about

agile

software

development

and
,

yeah
,

I

didn't

change

since

then
.

So
,

my

first

job

after

university

I

have

the

same

job

right

now
.

I

changed

many

companies
,

many

different

roles
,

I

wear

many

different

hats
,

but

this

is

how

I

came

to

this

profession

and

right

now

I

am

slightly

moving

away

from

that

because

I'm

focused

on

business

growth
,

but

still

I'm

product

at

heart

and

I

think

I

will

always

be
.

Alex Wilson-Campbell
10:23

And

was

there

a

particular

aha

moment

for

you

which

confirmed

that

you're

in

the

right

profession

and

in

the

right

role
?

Gleb Gordeev
10:31

I

would

say

when

I

just

joined

the

company

and

in

my

first

weeks

and

maybe

months

in

this

new

role
,

I

I

was

a

little

bit

lost
,

right
,

because

there's

so

much

uncertainty

involved

and

they

hired

me

for

some

specific

project

for

a

big

launch

of

the

product

in

a

new

country
,

and

I

remember

my

first

assignment

was

to

do

a

lot

of

QA
,

coordinate

bug

reporting

and

bug

fixing
,

I

would

say
,

and

then
,

of

course
,

I

would

say
,

and

then

of

course

I

was

also

involved

into

planning

of

the

features

for

this

launch

and

basically

very

much

involved

into

the

teamwork
.

And

perhaps

when

we

delivered

this

project

and

when

the

project

delivery

was

a

success
,

maybe

this

was

the

aha

moment

that

I

just

realized
.

Frankly
,

I

don't

remember
.

I

remember

that

I

enjoyed

it

from

day

one

and

I

really

felt

like

this

is

a

good

match

for

me

what

advice

can

you

offer

to

somebody

who's

looking

to

build

their

own

location
?

Gleb Gordeev
11:32

independent

career

so

I

really

I

think

it's

very

unlikely

that

you

will

build

this

location-dependent

career

in

the

place
,

which

is

location-dependent

Because
,

even

though

I

believe

transformation

happens

from

the

inside
,

our

outside

environment

matters

a

lot
.

So

if

you

want

to

become

location-dependent
,

I

recommend

to

go

to

the

place

where

similar

people

hang

out

and

just

ask

them

how

they

did

it
,

get

inspired

from

them
,

and

I

guarantee

that

you'll

have

so

many

ideas

which

you're

probably

not

going

to

have

in

the

place

where

you're

right

now
.

You

need

to

get

out

of

the

loop
.

You

need

to

try

something

new
.

You

need

to

do

something

counterintuitive

in

order

to

break

this

pattern
.

I

can

recommend

Portugal

or

Bali
,

mexico
,

colombia

there

are

so

many

places

where

people

go
.

Also
,

madeira

is

still

in

Portugal
,

canary

Islands

in

Spain

so

these

are

where

people

go

to

work

remotely

and

just

be

it
.

Creating a Remote Work Lifestyle

Gleb Gordeev
12:43

Tell

everyone

that
,

tell

yourself

that

this

is

my

new

life

now
,

and

I

guarantee

that

all

the

things

will

align

to

make

it

happen

what

made

you

choose

remote

work

as

an

option
?

Gleb Gordeev
12:56

I

think

my

answer

will

be

kind

of

boring
,

but

the

ability

to

escape

winter

was

my

main

motivation

in

the

beginning
.

I'm

coming

from

a

cold

country
,

like

in

my

hometown
,

I

think
,

nine

months

out

of

12
,

it's

very

cold
.

And

then

I

lived

in

Germany
,

in

Berlin
,

which

is

famous

for
,

like

it's

notorious

for

its

winters
,

that

it's

always

dark
,

and

I

think

everyone

from

Northern

Europe

can

relate

to

that
.

And

it's

not

only

the

weather
,

it's

just

activity

of

people

also

goes

down

dramatically

in

winter

and

I

was

never

a

big

fan

of

that

Like

why

should

we

be

in

hibernation

for

half

of

the

year
,

right
?

So

this

was

my

initial

motivation

to

get

out

from

the

winter
,

enjoy

the

sun

and

enjoy

the

activities
.

It

was

way

before

I

discovered

surfing
.

It

was

way

before

I

discovered

surfing
.

It

was

way

before

I

discovered

entrepreneurship
.

First

motivation

go

to

a

warm

place
,

avoid

winter
.

Alex Wilson-Campbell
13:55

And

how

would

you

describe

your

current

company's

culture
?

Gleb Gordeev
13:59

I

would

describe

it

as

lifestyle
.

First
,

we

are

three

co-founders

and

we

founded

this

venture

to

enable

us

to

live

the

life

we

want
,

and

we

prioritize

this
,

first

of

all
,

to

make

sure

that

we're

having

fun
,

to

make

sure

that

this

business

makes

us

happier

and
,

yeah
,

as

I

said
,

it

can

support

the

lifestyle

which

we

choose
.

It's

different

for

all

of

us
.

For

some

of

us
,

this

is

time

with

family
.

For

some

of

us
,

like

me
,

for

example
,

it's

surfing

and

traveling
,

enjoying

the

active

lifestyle
.

But

we

try

to

define

our

processes
.

We

try

to

define

our

processes
.

We

try

to

define

the

way

we

work

inside

the

company

from

this

point

of

view
.

Alex Wilson-Campbell
14:52

What

qualities

and

characteristics

do

your

hiring

managers

look

for

when

they're

recruiting

new

hires
?

Gleb Gordeev
14:59

Actually
,

the

number

one

thing

is

the

cultural

fit
.

The

company

is

very

young
.

It

means

that

every

single

person

which

we

bring

to

the

team

has

a

lot

of

impact

on

everything

we

do
,

and

it's

incredibly

important

that

we're

all

on

the

same

page

in

terms

of

responsibility
,

in

terms

of

communication
,

because

it's

also

a

remote

company
,

therefore
,

we

need

to

over-communicate

and

over-document

things
.

It

means

that

we

need

to

take

responsibility

for

what

we

do
.

We

need

to

be

accountable
,

so

there

is

no

need

for

micromanagement

and

I

would

say

this

is

the

most

important

thing

which

I

learned

by

doing

some

mistakes

that

cultural

fit

is

number

one

rule
,

I

think
,

for

all

the

startups
.

Therefore
,

I'm

involved

into

hiring

myself
,

because

all

the

hard

skills

they

can

be

taught
,

they

can

be

learned
.

We

have

this

expertise

in

the

company
.

I

have

absolutely

no

worries

about

that
.

But

how

a

person

fits

with

our

values
,

I

think

this

is

the

most

important
,

for

this

stage

at

least
.

Alex Wilson-Campbell
16:08

What's

your

philosophy

for

building

a

great

team
?

Gleb Gordeev
16:14

I

think

the

secret

of

a

great

team

is

to

enable

people

to

thrive

in

what

they're

curious

about

and

what

they're

good

at
.

We

have

different

preferences

and

we

like

two

different

things
,

and
,

of

course
,

work

is

not

always

about

fun
.

But

when

you

see

your

work

as

a

game

while

other

people

see

it

as

work
,

you

have

an

incredible

advantage
.

I'm

still

there
.

By

no

means

I

am

a

perfect

manager
,

but

I

think

what

we're

trying

to

do

is

to

find

the

task

which

seems

like

a

play

and

let

person

do

this

and

back

up

and

support

with

the

rest

of

the

tasks
.

So

in

this

case
,

we're

all

enjoying

it
,

having

fun
.

I

would

say

it's

better

for

60-70%
,

of

course
,

as

a

result

of

administrative

work
,

and

there

is

some

operational

work

which

just

has

to

be

done
.

But

yeah
,

I

think

the

more

we

scale
,

the

more

I

would

like

to

be

focused

on

that
.

Alex Wilson-Campbell
17:21

Is

there

a

particular

team

or

organization

whose

culture

you

admire
?

If

so
,

tell

us

about

that
.

Gleb Gordeev
17:29

I

can

only

speak

from

my

own

experience
.

Right
,

because

companies

show

you

what

they

want

us

to

see
.

But

from

point

of

view

of

product

delivery

and

product

management
,

I

really

admire

Spotify
.

I

have

not

worked

there
,

but

the

way

how

they

build

products

is

very

famous
.

They

brought

a

lot

of

innovation

into

product

development

and

most

of

the

companies

who

build

apps

and

modern

software

they

get

a

bit

of

inspiration

from

Spotify

model
,

maybe

even

without

knowing

this
,

but

as

a

business

owner
,

I

also

really

admire

the

work

culture

in

Amazon
,

where

I

was

working

as

well
.

Gleb Gordeev
18:11

So

there

are

a

lot

of

different

opinions

about

Amazon

as

a

company
,

but

I

see

it

from

the

point

of

view

of

a

business

owner

how

you

can

build

an

organization

with

almost

1

million

employees

and

scale

it

so

much

based

on

a

few

simple

principles
.

And

again
,

I

admire

it
.

I

don't

say

that

it's

perfect
,

I

don't

say

that

everyone

should

do

this
,

but

as

a

founder
,

I

have

a

huge

inspiration

for

this
,

because

it's

a

massive

progress

and

the

fact

that

they're

still

crushing

it
.

The

company

is

very
,

very

valuable
.

I

know

it

doesn't

matter
.

In

fact
,

it's

based

on

the

culture

which

we

created

there
.

Alex Wilson-Campbell
18:54

What

do

you

prefer

to

do

when

you're

not

working
?

Gleb Gordeev
18:57

I

love

surfing
,

doing

sports
,

enjoying

nature
,

traveling
,

going

out

with

my

friends
,

having

some

nice

dinner

or

just

chill

on

the

beach
.

I

love

reading
,

I

do

meditation
.

So

I'm

trying

to

schedule

time
,

not

trying

to
.

I'm

scheduling

time

for

myself
.

I'm

scheduling

time

with

my

close

friends

here

in

Bali

and
,

yeah
,

it's

a

beautiful

life
,

full

of

opportunities
.

Alex Wilson-Campbell
19:27

What

are

your

best

tips

for

organizing

your

day

and

staying

productive

while

working

remotely
?

Gleb Gordeev
19:34

It

makes

it

even

more

challenging

when

you're

a

business

owner

or

entrepreneur

or

solopreneur
,

I

mean
,

when

you

work

for

yourself
.

I

would

say

non-negotiable
.

You

need

to

have

a

working

place
.

So

I'm

going

to

a

working

person
,

but

you

can

also

equip

it

at

home
,

where

you

live
.

Non-negotiable

working

hours

for

deep

work

and

for

meetings
,

because

there

are

so

many

ways

how

you

can

get

distracted
.

There

are

so

many

fun

things

you

could

do
.

Gleb Gordeev
20:03

Having

this

fixed

few

hours

a

day
,

which

again

are

non-negotiable
,

will

really

help

you

to

keep

focus
.

But

what

is

also
,

having

this

fixed

few

hours

a

day
,

which

again

are

non-negotiable
,

will

really

help

you

to

keep

focus
.

But

what

is

also

important

is

to

listen

to

your

body

and

sometimes

we

just

cannot

focus
.

You

know
,

sometimes

it's

just

difficult

to

proceed

with

the

task
.

And

if

it

happens

to

you
,

don't

force

yourself

and

let

yourself

relax
.

Go

to

the

spa
,

go

to

the

beach
,

do

some

sports
,

like

you

know
,

ventilate

your

brain

and

then

come

back

later

or

maybe

next

day
.

Work-Life Balance in Remote Living

Gleb Gordeev
20:35

And

another

important

thing

is

that

don't

forget
,

while

you're

doing

this
,

why

you're

doing

this
.

Don't

forget

that

you

chose

this

lifestyle

for

the

things

which

are

happening

outside

of

work

and

of

course
,

work

is

super

important
.

But

you

are

there

in

this

remote

location

to

enjoy

life

right
,

and

sometimes

you

have

to

do

compromises
,

sometimes

you

have

to

cut

some

corners

because

I

don't

think

again
.

Sometimes

you

have

no

choice
,

including

myself
.

But

if

you

have

a

choice
,

don't

work

12

hours

a

day

during

your

trip
,

you

know
,

because

you're

not

there

for

this
.

You're

there

to

enjoy

outside
,

to

enjoy

the

community
,

to

enjoy

the

people
,

to

enjoy

your

hobbies
.

Don't

forget

about

it
.

Alex Wilson-Campbell
21:20

That's

it

for

today's

episode

of

the

Remote

Work

Life

podcast
,

but

if

you're

a

location-independ

solopreneur
,

founder

or

leader

and

want

to

provide

a

case

study

for

the

remote

work

life

podcast
,

get

in

touch

with

me

via

linkedin

using

the

link

below

in

the

show

notes
.